EPISODE 65
Live to Your Full Potential
In this inspiring episode, adventurer Renata Chlumska recounts her time supporting Göran Kropp’s historic, self-powered ascent of Mount Everest in 1996 and how witnessing both tragedy (the disaster Jon Krakauer chronicles in Into Thin Air) and triumph (Göran’s successful Everest summit) shaped her lifelong dreams and philosophy. In 2006, Renata followed the perimeter of the 48 contiguous United States by bicycle and kayak. In 2014, she conquered the Seven Summits, the highest mountain peaks on each of the continents. Renata reflects on the values that guided her expeditions, including the power of preparation, resilience, and living without shortcuts. This conversation celebrates courage, love, and the drive to transform passion into purpose. As Renata says, adventure isn’t about avoiding risk; it’s about embracing life fully and discovering what you’re truly capable of.
Photo credit:
Kaj Bune @kaj_bune_photography
Episode Transcript
Renata: That’s kind of how I was schooled into the world of adventures. And the only person you’re cheating is, of course, yourself. If you start taking those shortcuts, shortcuts is not for me, I guess.
Gabriel: You just heard Renata Chlumska, who has spent years completing incredible adventures without cutting corners. Among her long list of accomplishments is conquering the Seven Summits (that is, climbing to the highest peak on each continent), and completing a solo, unsupported expedition around the perimeter of the United States on bicycle and kayak. Much of Renata’s motivation can be traced back to a time and a place that will be familiar to readers of Jon Krakauer’s bestseller Into Thin Air: Mount Everest in May 1996, when a freak storm claimed the lives of eight climbers, including famed mountain guides Rob Hall and Scott Fischer. Renata was at base camp at the time of the disaster. How she got there, the dreams that were born while she was there, and what she went on to do, are all part of this unbelievable episode about Renata’s quest to live to her full potential.
Sandra: You’re listening to The Accidental Bicycle Tourist. In this podcast, you’ll meet people from all walks of life and learn about their most memorable bike touring experiences. This is your host, Gabriel Aldaz.
Gabriel: Hello, bicycle touring enthusiasts. Welcome to another episode of The Accidental Bicycle Tourist podcast. Over the years, I’ve noticed a crossover between the kind of people who love long distance bicycle travel and those driven to stand on the world’s highest peaks. Past guests like Svein Tuft, Dominic Gill, and Roman Dial are perfect examples of this. If you’ve read John Krakauer’s classic Everest book Into Thin Air, you might remember a brief surprising mention in Chapter 10. During a base camp meeting to coordinate summit plans, Krakauer writes, “It was determined that Göran Kropp, a young swede who had ridden a bicycle from Stockholm to Nepal, would make the first attempt alone on May 3rd.” Think about that. A solo, self-supported cyclist preparing to lead the way ahead of all the commercial guides and their clients. Moreover, he was trying it without supplemental oxygen or Sherpa support. Krakauer noted that on his first attempt, Göran “turned back just a couple hundred feet from the top. Realizing he was too exhausted to descend safely if he kept going.” On May 23rd, 1996, nearly two weeks after the disaster that is the subject of Into Thin Air, Göran Kropp reached the summit, becoming the first person to climb Everest entirely under his own power from sea level to peak. But there is a part of the story that Into Thin Air left out. Today’s guest is Renata Chlumska. She was Göran’s base camp manager, his partner, and the person who shared in this monumental effort. When the climb was over, Göran retrieved his bicycle to ride all the way back to Sweden, and this time Renata rode right alongside him. If you think that sounds wild, it’s only the beginning. So, after that lengthy introduction, Renata Chlumska, welcome to the show.
Renata: Thank you so much, Gabriel. And wow, yeah, what a great introduction. It took me quite a few years back, I have to say.
Gabriel: Well, we’re going to start back there. But first, at the very beginning, I do want to start at Mount Everest because after reading Into Thin Air, that is one of the last places where I would like to be, to be honest. Can you start with how you got to base camp and what was it like at base camp and supporting Göran and his effort? All of that is a lot to start with, but let’s take it from there.
Renata: Well, I met Göran for the first time early ’95. I used to work for the Swedish Sports Federation, and we had hired Göran to do a motivational talk for a young group of sports leaders that I was helping to manage. And I was blown away by his stories, his adventures – he had been on K2, Broad Peak, Shoryu – and also by his charisma, by his personality. At that point, for the first time in my life, I realized that you can actually have your passion as your profession. I mean, this was in ’95. I was 21. I had not realized that if you’re really good at something, regardless of what it is, it can become your profession. And I had always had an adventurous spirit, but never realized that that is actually something I could make a livelihood out of. And seeing Göran, just kind of opened new thoughts. I signed up for his paragliding course, actually.
Gabriel: Of course, paragliding, yes.
Renata: He had paragliding course in Slovakia, and my parents are from the Czech Republic. So I figured that’s going to be a nice way to kind of combine summer, maybe visit some family as well, close by. So I went and took my license, and Göran noticed me and thought that I, yeah, was very ambitious. And he asked me if I couldn’t help him arrange the courses while he was going away on his bicycling trip, because he started in fall of ’95. So he was just like in the middle of his preparation for this fantastic expedition that he did. I agreed to help him out. And then also I signed up for a climbing course. Yeah, I like to do all kinds of sports. Then I ended up helping him preparing and planning for his expedition, contacting sponsors and just logistics. And kind of was supposed to be his person here in Sweden. But during those months of his preparation, our partnership turned romantic. And we fell in love. And I got the fantastic opportunity to join him as part of the film crew. And film crew, it was me and a photographer. So it was a very small team, through Europe, Turkey, eventually Pakistan and then Nepal. So I ended up spending two months in base camp, spring ’96. And so everything, I mean, what Krakauer writes about, I was there and experienced it.
Gabriel: The book leaves off basically the day after the disaster or so, for the most part. Were the two of you at base camp when the survivors of this disaster came down from the top?
Renata: Yes.
Gabriel: It’s incredible to be at that place at that time.
Renata: I mean, at that point, at least I didn’t understand the repercussions of the tragedy. It’s just impossible to wrap your head around it, especially for me, because I wasn’t at that point an experienced climber. I had done a climbing course in the southern parts of Sweden. I had done the trek to base camp. I had been on Kala Patthar, did a small hike up Lobuche, or a small hike, while I climbed up Lobuche, not reaching the summit or anything. So I was a novice. This was Göran’s world, and he had experienced things before. But for me, it was just so impossible to understand that people had headed up on the mountain to fulfill dreams of their life and to accomplish something that they had trained and prepared for, and then not returning. And I had met Scott Fischer and Rob Hall and Doug Hansen and, yeah, many of the others who perished. And it was just hard to understand that this could happen. And Göran got involved in the rescue work and got up to Camp One or Camp Two with medicine. And then the helicopter was flying over base camp the whole time. And media. And we had phone calls from Sweden because two of the climbers, I think it was on Rob Hall’s team, was actually on the Swedish permit that we had. So it was complete chaos. But at the same time, I have to say that I wasn’t in one way that surprised, because I had met people that were going to climb that asked me advice and asked me questions. Like I was thinking, you know, this is something that they should probably know because they’re heading up on Mount Everest. I pretty early realized that there are people who don’t prepare, maybe as much as they should, and they rely extremely much on their skilled guides and their skilled Sherpas. Knowing the kind of climber Göran was and the stories that he shared with me, I mean, I understood that it’s fantastic if you have a strong team, but you have to be a strong member, and you have to know your limits and you have to know where to turn back. So yeah, it was just a challenging time in many ways. But of course, tragic for everybody involved, that lost their lives and their families.
Gabriel: Yeah. But after that, Göran still managed to summit a little time later. So he accomplished it.
Renata: Absolutely. He did. And he got, at least from Swedish media, he got a bit criticized for that, that he didn’t pack up and leave. But for him, it was his dream. And as a climber, he knew that he couldn’t change what had happened. And if something would have happened to him, he wouldn’t want people to give up their dream. But it was good to be on the mountain together also with the IMAX team, that there was a small group of people still left and that they managed to do it a few weeks later. Because of course, it’s a huge investment financially as well, and this was what he made a living out of, knowing that if he do this, then he can continue.
Gabriel: As if it weren’t enough that Göran and Renata, Rob Hall’s Adventure Consultants team, of which Jon Krakauer was a member, and Scott Fischer’s Mountain Madness team were all on Everest at the same time, there was also a team producing a high budget IMAX movie on the mountain. When the disaster occurred, director David Breashears halted filming temporarily and focused on helping the survivors, providing crucial oxygen bottles, supplies, and logistical support for the rescue effort. Eventually, the IMAX movie, called Everest, incorporated the disaster into its storyline. It was released in 1998 and became the highest grossing IMAX movie up to that time.
Gabriel: For me, one of the most thought-provoking parts of the book is several times their references to climbing past somebody who has died and is just frozen there and you just climb past them or, even worse, climbers who encounter other climbers who are close to death and frostbitten and very weak and they cannot give up their own dreams of reaching the summit and Krakauer just writes, this climber was just left and the people continued to the summit, and I just thought, okay, that’s not really for me. I would not want to make that choice.
Renata: I think leaving somebody behind, I can’t imagine being in that situation, but at the same time, passing somebody who has perished but the body cannot be brought down or meeting people who have frostbite or lost limbs or something from being on expeditions, I mean, we face that in one way in our everyday life. You meet people who have been in car accidents, you have meet people who have had accidents going to work and that changed their life, but you don’t stop driving your car, you don’t stop going to work. So we see that in our everyday life and we still do things. I mean, it’s like the ocean. When there are accidents, sometimes we cannot bring the people that we love home for different reasons and have to face that with a huge amount of respect and humbleness, I guess. You don’t want to walk over dead bodies and eventually the nature and the snow and avalanches, they will be covered in a way and see that and then think, okay, I have to be even more careful, even more cautious, turn back if needed. I think for it to be a reason to stop, then there’s a lot of things that we would never do because accidents happen all around us the whole time.
Gabriel: Sure.
Renata: For most people, I assume, they think that they will never want to do it because it is risky and dangerous and tragedies do occur, but for me, when I got to base camp, I just felt like I was at home. So for me, it was the beginning of what turned out to be a fantastic life with Göran in the beginning and then when he passed, I continued doing my adventures that I do now.
Gabriel: Now getting back to the bicycling, you made the decision to bicycle back together. How did that come about?
Renata: Well, I wanted to bicycle with Göran down, down, saying from Sweden to Nepal, which when I looked at the map, kind of felt like a downhill.
Gabriel: With a little up at the end.
Renata: Yeah, but figured to myself, you know, how difficult can that be? I had been competing in bicycling for quite a few years as a junior. That was kind of my family sport. My dad competed in bicycling. My older brother competed in bicycling. So I’ve always loved bicycling, not just competitively, but we always took trips over the weekends, out to the forest, outside the city where I live. My mother’s never had a driving license, so we’ve always biked everywhere, going grocery shopping or whatever. So bicycling is something that I feel very comfortable with and love and enjoy as a sport, as training, but also recreation and just socially. But yeah, Göran wouldn’t allow me to go with him on the bicycle to Nepal, because it was a solo expedition. So I’m glad that I got to join in the ways that I did. And also, we talked about this in one way, of course, he would love to have the company. He was a very social person. But at the same time, he knew that if his girlfriend would join him on the bicycle to Nepal, the expedition would be viewed differently from sponsors, from media, from the public that like, okay, are they out on a vacation? So that was another reason that he was not really positive with having me joining him to Everest. But once he had summitted and people thought the major part of the expedition was done, he wasn’t as worried if the girlfriend would tag along with him home. Because the hardest part was done. Yeah, we had a fantastic trip home. It took four months. We had to alter the route several times. We couldn’t go as he had done originally through Iran, Pakistan, and India. But I didn’t never got a visa to Iran, so we went through the northern parts of Pakistan instead. But yeah, I’m a stubborn person. So I was nagging him to let me go with him on the bike. And eventually he did.
Gabriel: And do you have any adventures or stories from that ride?
Renata: I mean, that’s a whole adventure in itself.
Gabriel: Yeah.
Renata: It really is, and it often kind of gets forgotten in all the other amazing things that he did, that he actually, after summitting, he trekked all the way back down to Jiri, where he had parked his bicycle and biked to Kathmandu, where I had had my bicycle shipped from Sweden. We were sponsored by Swedish band, Crescent Bikes, so they shipped the bike to me in Kathmandu. And it felt like Christmas when I was unpacking that and getting everything settled. And eventually we started our trip down to India. And it was fantastic, knowing that we have so many months ahead of us. And at the same time, not knowing what we will encounter every day is a new adventure in itself. At that time, I mean, we didn’t have social media. The communication was very scarce. We had a satellite phone, but all that is so expensive to use. So I remember telling my parents, you know, no news is good news. If you hear from me, don’t worry. Then everything is fine. If it’s when I start calling that I’m in trouble.
Gabriel: Yeah.
Renata: We were really off the grid, which was a nice feeling. Nobody thought it was strange that we didn’t have contact with the folks at home for two, three weeks. And the media actually found it authentic, because we’re out in the middle of nowhere.
Gabriel: Right. Oh, yeah, it’s definitely authentic. Just to conclude that trip, I know that Göran made a book about the trip. What was the name of that book?
Renata: It’s translated to English, then it’s called Ultimate High. It’s translated to German, Allein auf den Everest, I think that’s called. And then in Sweden, it’s 8,000 Plus. So yeah, it’s been translated a few times, but Ultimate High.
Gabriel: Did a movie get made that you were working on?
Renata: Yes, Fredrik Blomqvist, who was the better half of the film team. I was the chauffeur. He was filming. He did a fantastic documentary that participated in several film festivals, ended up winning like best of show with Banff.
Gabriel: Oh, wow.
Gabriel: Fredrik Blomqvist’s award-winning movie about Göran’s expedition, called I Made It!, is currently looking for a new home after Vimeo on Demand shuts down in September, 2026. We will let you know when it’s once again available for viewing. Göran was on the road for exactly one year. That’s also interesting, that he should end on the exact same day. That shows something about his personality, I think.
Renata: Yes.
Gabriel: Usually when you get back after these kind of long trips and you’ve been focused on it for so long, you go, well, what should I do next? Did you have that time or was it already on to the next project?
Renata: Yeah, knowing Göran’s personality, he had a plan for what was coming next. And I think even for me, when I’ve been on my adventures, for us, for him, any project is a huge investment. So whenever you come home, I mean, you’re out of funds. You used everything, probably even more that you have. You’ve borrowed money, I mean, just to make it back. So when he was home, kind of the next leg of the project started, and that is to make the most of that investment. And he had sponsors that had planned to do speaking engagements and speaking tours. And it was actually at the press conference on his arrival on the October 16th, ’96, that the publisher approached him about doing a book. A whole new kind of chapter started after that. And I have never come home feeling empty and wondering, okay, what should I do now? I’ve always been so filled with the experience, the meetings, the memories. And that is something that I enjoy spending time at home. I’ve never felt rushed into a new expedition. Göran wasn’t in a hurry to do a new project either. I mean, this is something that he had planned for so many years. I kind of want to continue living with that project, but from a different perspective.
Gabriel: I think that makes sense. I just can’t imagine a person like that then being satisfied with speaking engagements and other obligations. I felt like he would maybe try to do something after that.
Renata: I mean, it’s not like he didn’t do anything. We continued to go climbing. We went to Shishapangma the year after, where I became the first Swedish woman above 8,000 meters without supplementary oxygen. So we were still very active and climbing and planning expeditions and projects. Then we had a business where we shared our experience and our knowledge guiding. So we took people with us to Kilimanjaro, for instance, or to Everest Base Camp and to Nepal. I often get the question, “Didn’t you feel empty or what happened when you come home? Don’t you feel like you have this itch in your body and you have to get away on something new the whole time?” I’ve never experienced that. I know Göran couldn’t either. Göran, of course, had other dreams and goals and ambitions and expeditions he wanted to do, but he was also very good at resting in what he had accomplished and to enjoy that, to do speeches and have speaking engagement is such a fantastic opportunity to relive everything that you’ve been through and you share those stories with other and that’s inspiration to other people. He was an amazing speaker. People would, you know, walk out through walls after his talk. So filled with energy and inspiration and that gave him also something back, to be able to show what a person actually can do if you’re determined enough and prepared to work hard enough for it.
Gabriel: You mentioned you’re the first Swedish woman above some point you also summitted Everest.
Renata: Yes, absolutely. When I got to base camp in ’96, again, a whole new world opened up and I sometimes joke about, I mean when I grew up my parents, again, are from the Czech Republic. When we went on vacations we went camping all over Europe. My dad would drive in a small car. It was packed with camping gear and we would go to Spain, to Portugal, to Italy and we would spend our summer holiday camping in a tent. We didn’t have any, you know, RV trucks or anything like that or campers. We had a tent. That’s how the Czechs do it. That’s how we did it. That’s how we did it. So that’s how I grew up and I sometimes joke about when Göran invited me to join him in base camp he had had one previous girlfriend that was with him when he was on K2 and she had left like after a week, 10 days, because life in base camp can be pretty harsh. There’s no water, I mean you have the glacier of course, but there’s no showers, no toilets. It’s very primitive and sometimes we used to joke about he invited me to base camp thinking she’s going to leave in one week. That’s the best way to get rid of her. Put her through that and she’s going to make a quick exit. But this cookie doesn’t crumble. For me, this is the vacation I’m almost used to, just different altitude. And I just loved it. I met the first Danish woman, Lena Gammelgaard, that summited in 1996. I met Araceli Segarra. They were beautiful, they looked smart, they didn’t look like those former Easter- country women that I had imagined, you know, that a mountaineer is big and hairy. I was so inspired. So it was in 96 that I got to base camp and I saw all these climbers disappear up on the mountain and I felt instantly that I want to do that too. Base camp just wasn’t enough. I said that to Göran and the small hiking that I had done up Lobuche and Kala Patthar and some ice climbing in the area, I was like, I want to give this a try. And he of course was very happy to have found somebody who maybe could share his passion for this. We kind of started thinking about what would my next step be and trying the altitude which’d kind of be the first obstacle to see if I can manage, if I one day want to summit Everest, was to go to Shishapangma. So in ’96 my dream of reaching Everest was in a way born and also I started reading a lot, and I read about the Seven Summits and I just realized, you know, this climbing is endless. The variation, summer, spring, small hills, large mountains, and imagine to be able to bike to all of those too. We had so many ideas of things that we wanted to do, and that we could do it together was amazing.
Gabriel: Can you talk about then the expedition in which you summited together?
Renata: It took me a couple of years to train and to prepare and made sure that I was ready physically and mentally and in ’99 was the year that I decided that’s when I’m going to go for it. We were actually a very fast expedition. We were a pretty small expedition. It was me, Göran, we had a friend with us that we had climbed together previously and then we had a filmer, so we were just four people from Sweden climbing and then we had three high altitude Sherpas and it took me less than three weeks to summit still climbing expedition-style, so acclimatizing along the way. But I think, learning from what I experienced in ’96, I also knew that if the weather comes there’s no time to wait to be fast, to be efficient, take advantage of the good weather because the longer time you spend on the mountain the weaker you’re going to become. So I just knew that my chances increase if I move faster as long as I feel acclimatized.
Gabriel: That’s an interesting balance on the mountain, because, yeah, the longer you spend the weaker you get. But then on the other hand you do also have to be acclimatized to some extent to the altitude, so it’s a very fine line you’re trying to balance.
Renata: It sure is. And on the 5th of May in ’99, I summited as the first Swedish and Czech woman that’s an advantage of having dual citizenship.
Gabriel: That’s quite an achievement.
Renata: Yeah. I was 25.
Gabriel: Wow. When was the dream of doing the Seven Summits born?
Renata: That was already forming in ’96 and that came from me reading some of the climbing literature and realizing that that project exists and it was Göran’s idea of maybe we should not bicycle back to Sweden in ’96. Maybe we should just continue get across somewhere to Papua New Guinea or if we go to Africa first or if we go to Elbrus maybe. He also knew that if you’re out too long, which it would have been if we would have bicycled, you know, then people kind of tended to forget you also in a way at least then when again social media wasn’t it’s hard to promote yourself in that sense. Today, the opportunities are so different. And we were out of money, so we kind of had to go back and make a living and earn new capital so we could leave again. For me, Everest was always the start of the Seven Summits, knowing that there will be other mountains, and the year after, in 2000, I went to Kilimanjaro and then we kind of had a plan to do one mountain every year. But as we know plans change, right?
Gabriel: Yeah, you mentioned of course that Göran passed away. It was a climbing accident. I mean, I know nothing about climbing, but it wasn’t the big mountain. Or… I don’t know, can you talk about that?
Renata: We had moved to Seattle, or outside of Seattle, to Issaquah, to be able to prepare and plan for our paddling expedition. That was kind of the next big project that we were doing. I was in Nepal guiding a group to base camp and then Göran was away, climbing with some new people that knew he was in the area and that had contacted him and we’re looking forward to get to hang out with Göran Kropp, and they went to a wonderful rock climbing area where Göran and I had been climbing several times. It’s called Vantage, or Frenchman Coulee, a bit east from Seattle out in the desert. He fell and I have never read the accident report that was made from the Swedish Climbing Association, but yeah, he fell and couldn’t be saved.
Gabriel: Yeah. Definitely a tragic moment.
Renata: Very much so, yeah.
Gabriel: Also an inspiration I think for the rest of your life to keep doing all of these things you’ve done.
Renata: For me, Göran was such a huge source of inspiration, but not just for me. My sadness and sorrow has, of course, been losing him. I mean, he was the love of my life. He was a fantastic partner and friend and we had our business together, so there were so many things that I lost when I lost him, but I always felt that the biggest loss was for him, because he had so much more to give and he had so much more he wanted to accomplish. We need people like him in our world. That’s kind of the biggest grief and the biggest sorrow, that his life couldn’t continue. So for me, not to live at my fullest potential and to maximize would have been to let him down. He always said that you know, we have one life. If we have more then that’s a bonus. We have one life and we have to maximize it. We owe that to ourselves to make the most of it. So if I would have not continued… maybe I could have continued in a completely different field… I wasn’t sure if I was going to continue you know doing adventures as a profession when Göran died. Anyway, regardless of what path I would have chosen I would have owed it to him to do it 100 percent, because he couldn’t so I always felt like I have to. I want to.
Gabriel: I’m not sure. You were talking about a paddling project but, one of the amazing things you did was this trip around the United States. We would call it, I guess, multi-sport. Bicycling and kayaking. This is just incredible. So, maybe we should talk about that next?
Renata: Yes, of course, if you want to.
Gabriel: It’s got a bicycle in it. Let’s go!
Renata: It’s got a bicycle in it. Yeah, no, that was an amazing expedition. The whole idea was born in 2000 and we moved to the US and we had a plan to start in 2003, and the idea was to circumnavigate the lower 48 states of the United States. Kayaking and actually walking. The bicycle was not in the original idea. We were going to have a foldable tandem kayak and when we were not paddling, we were supposed to walk
Gabriel: Wow.
Renata: We might have come to a different conclusion if Göran would have still been alive, and we would have continued to talk, but when he died that’s kind of how far we have come to the idea and we started testing kayaks and decided that that’s how we’re going to do it. When Göran had his tragic accident, his fatal accident, I pretty shortly after that decided that I’m going to try and see if I can finish the expedition, or to at least start the expedition for several reasons. First of all, I had nothing else to do. I mean, my life was shattered. I didn’t know which direction to go in. I kind of started grasping for those small, yeah, whatever I could to kind of get me out of bed some days, and this expedition was the last on the agenda. I was living in Seattle. I had started to get a good network of people there. I had Helly Hansen was our main sponsors, and they were such a fantastic support in everything that happened. So when I mentioned to them that I’m actually thinking about maybe trying to start the expedition and, or at least see how far I can make it, they were so supportive. I said to myself that I’m going to start and see how far I can go. And maybe I end up feeling that, okay, this is not what I want to do. It’s what I want to do or I don’t want to do it without Göran. I had no idea what I would face, but I felt like I have to face it. Otherwise I’m always going to wonder how it could have gone. So I said, I’m going to see how far I can go with this project. It took me another two years to make it to the starting point.
Gabriel: Yeah.
Renata: As it always is, so many obstacles that I had to overcome but eventually on the 4th of July in 2005 I started paddling. Left Seattle, paddled out through the Puget Sound out to the Straits of Juan de Fuca, out to the Pacific Coast, turned my kayak south and paddled the Pacific Coast all the way down to San Diego. There I got on my bike then I bicycled along the Mexican border down to the Gulf of Mexico, continued to bicycle a part because Hurricane Katrina had struck that entire coast of Louisiana, Mississippi and Alabama. I wasn’t safe in the ocean, so I bicycled quite a lot along the Gulf of Mexico and then paddled around Florida, up the Atlantic Coast, and then bicycled from Eastport back to Seattle. And that took me 439 days, 18,200 kilometers. So yeah that’s kind of a short version.
Gabriel: Yeah, well, I want to get into some more details. The first question is how did the bicycle get to the different places when you were kayaking?
Renata: When I started thinking about continuing this expedition by myself, I realized that I have to modify it a bit, so that’s when I added the bicycle part because, again, I love to bicycle, just knowing that it’s going to make things so much easier to have a bicycle on land. I started looking for foldable bicycles to actually be able to have one with me in the kayak, to kind of constantly be able to move, because I knew that there will be days when the weather will not be suitable for paddling. Too big surf or, you know, just too dangerous, so I still constantly want to be able to move. But I realized that that will not work because of the balance in the kayak and just the gears on such a small foldable bike. I mean, it just, it won’t be very efficient. So I decided to get help with arranging a bicycle drop-off and pick up at certain locations, and the first one was in San Diego. So there I picked up the bike that I was going to bicycle, so that was just, you know, logistically pretty easy arranged at the bike shop that had the bike that I kind of decided to go for.
Gabriel: Was there a trailer?
Renata: Yes. I had the trailer for the kayak with me the entire time, and that was a custom made trailer that the friend here in Sweden made for me out of steel. I was thinking first to do it out of aluminum but then I understood that aluminum is harder to weld, so steel, if it breaks, then it’s easier to get it fixed although it weighs a bit more. But it’s always that balance, you know, go light and fast or have something that’s more durable and weighs a bit more.
Gabriel: Right.
Renata: That trailer was with me the whole time. I could take it into smaller parts and place it so it had a good spot in the kayak and because even if I couldn’t bicycle I still needed to be able to have the kayak, drag it behind me when I was on shore or if I needed to get up on land and look for provision or for water or whatever. So that trailer was with me the whole time. Either I had it attached to a harness, or I had it attached to the bicycle.
Gabriel: Let me just say right off the bat this is a crazy idea that you had. This is absolutely nuts, but obviously it worked. One other question, logisticswise, was it the same bicycle that you would then pick up after your next kayak segment or was like, did the San Diego bicycle go back to San Diego and then there was another bicycle waiting later or how did that work?
Renata: I had the same bicycle, same kayak, almost all expedition gear that I had was the same. So I had help again just transporting it to the next kind of destination, where I knew I would bicycle. So that was easy, just get somebody to ship it.
Gabriel: Okay.
Renata: If that bicycle would for some reason not have arrived then I could have used any bicycle but what was important for me was that I had the same kayak, because I had everything, you know, fitted for that kayak but I could have used any bicycle.
Gabriel: Got it! I think that takes care of the logistics. I’m going to guess that you ran into some kind of difficulties. You’ve just stated the whole route, and it all sounded very good but a trip of this magnitude, of this length of time, you ran into trouble somewhere I’m sure. What was your biggest obstacle during the trip?
Renata: When you said I ran into difficulties, I think that kind of depends on how you view difficulties.
Gabriel: Okay, okay.
Renata: I knew it was going to be challenging. I knew it’s going to be tough. I knew it’s going to be hard. I knew I was going to have days when I’m going to be tired and cold and hungry and exhausted, but that’s kind of point of it. For me, that’s nothing if it’s going to be an easy ride. I mean, I was going to say, what’s the point, right? And I have to say, I was out for over a year and of course it’s impossible to imagine everything that will happen, but for the amount of time I was out very few things happened that kind of threw me off. What actually did throw me off the most was how extremely friendly everybody were. Really, I left with a really high guard, being prepared to encounter burglars and rapists and I mean just, you know, horrible people along the way but. Thought a lot about how to avoid those kind of situations and had plans for that, but I was not prepared for how friendly people were. I mean it was just amazing and that’s also what kept me going and it gave me the courage to continue. People were so friendly, so helpful, so supportive. Of course I’ve had some encounters there were less pleasant, but that’s nothing strange to what I would in a normal city, you know, where I grew up, just people not being super friendly and stuff like that. So I have to say, it was a very positive experience. Of course, tiring and challenging, but fantastic.
Gabriel: That’s great.
Renata: What I really loved about the bicycle part is I remember a family that I met in Cannon Beach, on the coast of California, because if I could camp on campgrounds, of course, that made it easier because there was access to different facilities and water and so on. And this was a camping grounds for RV trucks and when I got my campground assigned to me it was just next one of those huge campers that almost, not fold out but they, you know, they can become wider.
Gabriel: Yeah, yeah.
Renata: And they have laundry machines and dishwashers and it’s just like anything you would have in your normal house.
Gabriel: A big-screen television.
Renata: Yeah, everything. The contrasts are pretty obvious, where you have these two campers and then there is a square where I had to put my tent, a small one person Unna Hilleberg. And I started fixing my dinner on my Primus stove and it didn’t take many minutes before the families who were there for holiday in the campers wouldn’t walk over. And they were like wondering, oh, you poor thing, are you gonna sleep in that? Pointing on my tent. And wondering, are you gonna eat that? Pointing on my freeze-dried food. And is that your kitchen? So they invited me over to join them for their family barbecue and I had s’mores for the first time in my life, and I got to tell my stories. They were from Orange County. They asked me how the rest of my route was gonna be, and I said, well, I’m gonna continue paddling and it’s gonna be a bit of challenge when I get to Los Angeles, because as soon as I pass cities it’s always harder for me to find safe places to spend the night, and I have to get up on land earlier to find motels and so on. And they said, “Oh no. We will help you.” So I got their number and when I got to Los Angeles I called them and they actually picked me up in their truck. They would put the kayak on the roof, all my gear, and then they would drive me home. They had found a recipe for Swedish pancakes, so they made me Swedish pancakes and then they drove me back to the exact location where they had picked me up, and I could continue paddling, and they would pick me up again and make sure that I had a safe night sleep and I got a good meal again and then they drove me back and they did that for four days.
Gabriel: Four days!
Renata: Yeah, that’s actually one of the families that adopted me. This is so amazing. When I ended up back in Seattle on the September 15 in 2006, I had friends in Sweden who had promised to come and visit me during the expedition and maybe bike with me for some stretches, or at least get to the point where I actually finished. A few friends made it but most friends never showed up, but this family actually flew to Seattle and they were there when I crossed the finish line. Then when I was back in Sweden, they would call me every Sunday for almost a year, because that’s when they called their kids that, you know, were studying in different places. so they were just amazing. Frank and Sharon Koska, so a shout-out to them, one of many fantastic people that I met along the way. But just really, really amazing.
Gabriel: That is above and beyond.
Renata: It is.
Gabriel: So important too because Los Angeles, the greater metropolitan area is so many kilometers of coastline.
Renata: Yeah, took me four days to paddle past it.
Gabriel: Along the coast, the built-up areas kind of extend between San Diego and LA. It’s still quite built up. I think the biggest exception is, you have Camp Pendleton in between, so they’re not allowed to build there.
Renata: Yeah.
Gabriel: You must have passed Camp Pendleton, somehow.
Renata: Yeah. That’s military, right?
Gabriel: Yeah.
Renata: I couldn’t paddle there. I had to walk, and there’s been a couple of those, because when I didn’t have my bicycle I would have to walk. So there were a couple of sections where I was actually asked to get out of the water and to go, yeah, around it, because I wasn’t allowed to paddle.
Gabriel: Oh, was that only on the Pacific?
Renata: That was on the Atlantic coast as well, not too far from New York, where I had another of those encounters. That was not a problem just to obey and do as I was told.
Gabriel: And so then you had to somehow just pull the trailer with the kayak in it?
Renata: Yeah, just up on land. Yeah, any small road, I walked on and bicycled on gravel roads, highways. I mean, just wherever I can find a way. That actually was something that was tricky off and on too, because obviously there are roads where you’re not allowed to bicycle, and you’re not allowed to bicycle on quite a few bridges, so I had to take detours sometimes, because I couldn’t bike across certain bridges, like across the Mississippi.
Gabriel: Right.
Renata: And there was one incident up along the Canadian border, because at that point I had some issues with sitting in the kayak for many, many hours. I started to develop pain, so my possibility to paddle was getting shorter, because it was just so painful sometimes to sit in the kayak. Then biking was easier, so around the Great Lakes I had the bicycle with me and my parents actually joined me for three weeks. So then I could paddle if I wanted to paddle and then they helped me, had the bike on the car, and then I could switch a bit how I felt. And then there was one time, I decided to go north of the Great Lakes and go into Canada, to avoid like Detroit and some larger cities, just felt safer. So I went into Canada but then I didn’t realize that the re-entry into the US might actually be a bit tricky because of visas and stuff, and I had planned to paddle back into the US, but then I was told that you’re not allowed to re-entry the US on a vessel in the water, because my visa didn’t permit to do that. And I wasn’t allowed to bicycle on that specific bridge, so suddenly I found myself not being able to get back into the US. So everybody said, well, just throw your kayak on a bus, or something, because at that point my parents were not with me, cross the bridge and then you’re done. And then I knew, but then I haven’t bicycled, or then I haven’t done all the miles by myself. That would be cheating. What I eventually ended up doing was, I did get a lift across the bridge, because I wasn’t allowed to bicycle, and there was like no way to go around it otherwise. So I did get a lift across the bridge and got back into the US legally without any issues. And then I went down to the water, because of course the bridge crossed a body of water that was the border between the US and Canada, and I got in my kayak and I paddled along the bridge that I had just drove across, and I almost touched the shoreline on the Canadian side, you know, like touched it with my paddle and then I paddled back again to the US, so I did the stretch twice.
Gabriel: You are a very stubborn person.
Renata: I knew that if I don’t do it like I had promised myself to do it, I’m always going to be upset with myself of not finding a solution and always thinking about that kilometer, I mean the bridge wasn’t even a kilometer, that I actually didn’t do by my own strength. And that came back from seeing how focused Göran was and how determined he was when he did his expedition, that every meter every kilometer that he was moving forward was going to be by his own strength. That’s kind of how I was schooled into the world of adventures, and the only person you’re cheating is of course yourself, if you start taking those shortcuts. Shortcuts is not for me, I guess.
Gabriel: Probably the border was the midpoint of this bridge. You do realize that by doing this, you probably ended up entering the United States by vessel anyway.
Renata: Anyway. I hope, how do you call it, prescribed? No, that’s past now. I won’t get into any trouble for that now.
Gabriel: The statute of limitations or whatever?
Renata: Yeah, something like that, yeah.
Gabriel: It was 20 years ago.
Renata: Yeah, I remember bicycling along the Mexican border in the south. I was in Texas. I was heading to Big Bend National Park, because I wanted to paddle parts of the Rio Grande. I came to this crossroad and there is a small house and there is a man sitting on the porch and it was, you know, just classic, for me at least, seen taken from an American movie, where there’s a man on the porch in a rocking chair. You have the wind chimes. In the desert, a bit of wind. I like striking conversations. I could have, you know, continued, but then you see somebody and I started chatting with him, and I said, okay, I have my map and there’s two routes. There’s one that doesn’t follow Rio Grande as much and then there’s one that follows the canyon a bit more. And he said, oh, you had definitely have to take the scenic route. It’s just so much more beautiful. So I thanked him for that and I headed out for the scenic route, but what he forgot to tell me is that the steepest hill in Texas is there and my kayak weighed 100 kilos fully loaded.
Gabriel: Wow.
Renata: I mean, even the slightest uphill, I just couldn’t bicycle. I had to get off the bicycle and start pushing the bicycle and the kayak, you know, next to me. So that was extremely difficult, to get up that hill, and I had along the way people meeting me, you know, cars passing me and wondering, like, are you lost? of course, I had moments there that I kind of doubted, you know, or questioned, what am I doing? Is it worth it? And also a bit of the fear of knowing that, if for some reason the kayak loosens from the bicycle, you know, the kayak would be like a projectile. It’s going to kill somebody if it gets loose here and now, and the expedition will be over. But I managed to push the kayak up the whole way and get to the crest, and this is actually on video, because I had a friend bicycling with me, also for safety reasons, knowing that I’m much more exposed on land than I am on sea. So when I was bicycling along the Mexican border I had a friend going with me there. So I got some really nice video of when I get up this crest, I raise my hands, and I’m so happy that I’ve made the steepest hill in Texas, and I start to cry in the video, because then I realized, I think for the first time it really hits me, what Göran did in ’96. I mean, I knew that his bicycle challenge was difficult, and I had been in Nepal filming him, also pushing his bike all the way to Jiri. I mean, it’s two, three, four thousand meters high, and his trailer was extremely heavy, and he had been biking for six months, and he was exhausted. But it wasn’t until the point where I kind of put myself in the almost the same position that I realized what his accomplishment actually was. Yeah, I just found this different connection to him, or even deeper connection to him there, and then I enjoyed the downhill on the other side.
Gabriel: When you’re pulling that much weight, any incline just feels like Mount Everest at that point.
Renata: Yeah.
Gabriel: You know, obviously there was the physical challenge but this was also a big motivation after Göran passed to do something like this. Approaching the finish line in Seattle what thoughts were going through your mind?
Renata: Very many different thoughts. In one way, I think I was maybe sad, that the expedition was ending, because it is a fantastic way to live your life and a very easy way in some sense to be out on an expedition. You know that day that I’m going to move from A to B. That’s kind of the goal and that you can focus on. There’s a lot of distraction from traffic and people you meet along the way, but it’s still a very much easier life than you have many times at home. There’s not so many things you have to juggle at the same time. It’s a very simplified way of living. But of course it’s also very hard to pitch your tent every night in a new place, in a new location. Even if I could fall asleep feeling safe it’s not like the safeness that you feel in your own home, so that kind of gets exhausting after a certain amount of time as well. So it was a combination of feelings but then of course relief knowing that I had made it. I will never forget the morning after. I was going to stay in Seattle for the press conference and for some media and for my sponsors and so on, so I had rented an apartment in downtown Seattle overlooking the Puget Sound. The windows in the bedroom were of glass so I could lay in my bed, pull the sheet over, snug in, and look down at the Puget Sound seeing the ferries going across to Bainbridge Island. It was September, so it was one of those days you have the kind of constant drizzle that you have in Seattle. Just knowing that today I don’t have to go paddling, that was the amazing feeling, knowing that today I don’t have to get in my dry suit, get in the kayak, and start paddling. Today I can actually, you know, be lazy and lie in bed. That was a nice feeling too. So a combination of sensations and very grateful and thankful that I had made it. Sadness that Göran wasn’t with me on that trip, although he was in his way there the whole time. But thankful for all the people that I had met, for everything that I had seen and learned, and just so filled with this adventure. And I still am that’s something that lives with me forever
Gabriel: Getting back to the mountaineering, you went on to complete the Seven Summits.
Renata: Yes, I eventually did.
Gabriel: Which is a w- hole nother podcast episode we will not touch on too much.
Renata: No.
Gabriel: Incredible.
Renata: In 2014 – I mean, I stopped climbing when Göran died in 2002 – the dream of doing the Seven Summits kind of was put on hold. It never completely left me. But then in and I… by then I had five muntains left. I had done Everest and Kilimanjaro, so I went back to Kilimanjaro, that I’ve been on many times because I’ve guided there to acclimatize, and then the five mountains that I had left I did in six months.
Gabriel: Wow, that’s the fast track.
Renata: That’s not how I originally kind of wanted to do it. I wanted to ski to Vinsom on the Antarctica, just get a bit of the polar pioneer sensation, feeling. I wanted to dog sled in Alaska to Denali and I wanted to horseback ride to Aconcagua in Argentina and learn how to dance the tango along the way, but life changes and so I had decided to make it fast and efficient, which you end up being really good at. What’s so great about bicycling is that you can afford to bring quite a few stuff along, which is nice compared to when you’re trekking, because then you carry everything on your backpack, which makes it so heavy. On the bicycle, that’s a bit more forgiving, but it’s not like in a car. You cannot pull up any any windows, you’re not protected from the environment around you, you’re very exposed, which also is what makes it so rewarding, because you have to interact. You meet the people, you smell the smells, you get the wind and the heat and the cold, and it’s a fantastic way to discover the world and yourself. It’s very much a journey both out into the world but also inside. You get a lot of time to think when you’re on a bicycle. You’ve actually learned how to almost sleep on a bicycle as well, when you’ve done it long enough.
Gabriel: What about long-distance kayaking? Should I be taking that up too?
Renata: Oh, absolutely. That’s fantastic too. I mean, anything that we are fortunate to break this everyday routine that most of us have and to experience something different, where you get into a completely different mode for a couple of months or, I mean, some people do it years even, but then that is not breaking. Then you’re kind of in a new mode, to do those breaks and get into those different mindsets once in a while, I think, it’s good for our mental health very much.
Gabriel: Oh yeah. For sure.
Renata: I hope to inspire people to do things that they are curious of and realize that we can do so much more if we dare.
Gabriel: And what are you daring to do next?
Renata: I bought the ticket with Virgin Galactic in 2010 and I have a dream to one day, and I’m saying this one day, I don’t know if it’s going to be in 10, 15, or 20 years, but one day I would like to climb the highest mountain on the moon.
Gabriel: Oh!
Renata: So this is kind of my first step to get acquainted with space. Yeah, I have a ticket with Virgin Galactic.
Gabriel: But the ticket doesn’t have a specific date.
Renata: No, it’s not… well, when I bought it in 2010 Richard Branson said we will fly next year, and I’m still waiting. So we’ll see.
Gabriel: Oh wow, OK. Highest mountain on the moon. I mean, that is an awesome goal.
Renata: Yeah, and if I could bike there, I would do that too.
Sandra: The transcript for this episode is available on The Accidental Bicycle Tourist website. I welcome feedback and suggestions for this and other episodes. You’ll find a link to all contact information in the show notes. If you would like to rate or review the show, you can do that on your favorite podcast platform. You can also follow the podcast on Instagram. Thank you to Anna Lindenmeier for the cover artwork and to Timothy Shortell for the original music. This podcast would not be possible without continuous support from my wife, Sandra. And thank you so much for listening. I hope the episode will inspire you to get out and see where the road leads you.
Gabriel: When you say foldable, do you mean disassembleable?
Renata: Yeah, sorry. Yeah, exactly. Diss… exactly. Diss… I could put it into smaller parts.